How to Buy a .257 Roberts Ultimately, it comes down to personal preference. Hunters, in turn, would need to be convinced that the .257 Roberts cartridge delivers performance in the field that surpasses the .243 Winchester, which is already being offered in the Long Ranger rifle. I mentioned earlier that the .257 Roberts has a reputation for being a mild shooting cartridge. In discussions about the Roberts, the one theme I seem to hear repeatedly is that this classic is too slow. 1/16 inch to increase powder capacity. Remingtons .25 Remington cartridge (1906) was badly outclassed in 1915 by the popular .250 Savage. Whitetail hunting strategies for the next generation. Recently, the renewed . So far, Boddington's Dakota .257 Roberts produces its best groups with Remington 100-grain round-nose Core-Lokt, not the most ideal hunting load for a flat-shooting cartridge. History [ edit] For hunters wanting deep penetration, the Barnes 80- and 100-grain Tipped Triple Shock X-Bullet and Hornady 90-grain GMX are proven choices. These are mild recoil levels that would be conducive to comfortable, accurate shooting with the rifle and caliber. Now load the same bullet weight in the .25-06 Remington and
Next, I developed a trajectory table for the load using the ShootersCalculator trajectory calculator. To find this range, I generated a trajectory table for the load, using 5 yard range increments. Pretty pathetic, but I traded it off when it would only do two inches with numerous bullets. This accuracy situtation with the Bob has me reconsidering doing this. As usual,
My Son recently bought a Kimber 84M Select Classic .257 Roberts that has been sub MOA with every load we've tried. : 42,200 45,000 Hodgdon 60 gr SP (HDY) 0.257" Powder: BL-C (2) (Hodgdon) .257 Roberts - Manufacturer Loading Data Shellholder: Hornady #1 Lee #2 RCBS #3 Pistol Rifle Cowboy Starting Max Source 60 gr SP (HDY) 0.257" Powder: Benchmark (Hodgdon) Primer: REM 9 Case: REM Trim Length: 2.223" C.O.L. (All three of the .257 Roberts loads have KPS = 15 ranges that are longer than their MPBR distances.). A: In my opinion the .257 Ackley is badly overrated. was the deciding factor of a host cartridge later to bear his name. The .243 Win. The popularity and dual-purpose nature of the .250 Savage and the .257 Roberts were usurped in 1955 by the .243 Winchester and the .244 Remington (later renamed 6mm Remington). Hopefully, this process will become clear after we look at some data. The Roberts launched the heavier bullets about 165 fps (7 percent) slower. ), 275 yard KPS = 16.9 (Energy = 1292 ft. The .257 Roberts is the Goldilocks of whitetail cartridges. I did some estimates of recoil with the heavy hunting loads I have featured. extremely adaptable to most powders in the medium burning range. The Roberts offers no real handloading challenges. velocity or wear and tear on the rifle or shooter. I used the Hogdon reloading data to get a starting point and worked up from there. To summarize, the .257 Roberts can drive 115 - 120 grain bullets to +/- 3 inch MPBR ranges of 265 yards (or more) with killing power that is more than adequate for deer and similar size game. All I can say is that granting Bob +P status in 1974 was a great kindness. Try IMR 4064 with 100 gr. In 1934, Remington Arms showed interest in the cartridge, changed the
yards or less. This cartridge is at its best when loaded
However, in thumbing through my notes from many years ago, factory loads generally run between 50 and 100 fps slower than claimed velocities when fired from the 22-inch barrel of the Ruger M77R. it ain't the cartridge. Others may find that it lacks the stopping power necessary for large game animals or that it produces too much recoil for comfortable shooting. shoulder angle. Also have a 257 AI, watch your cases with that RL 17 load you are using. (SD is the ratio of a bullet's weight in pounds to the square of its diameter in inches.). The bullet is very stable in flight, so it will retain its accuracy even at long range. For a while, Ruger chambered
I feel this even more strongly after making a detailed examination of the performance and capabilities of the cartridge. For comparison, the .30-06 has a MAP of 60,000 psi. We show you how. Partition, elk could also be on the menu! Since we have looked at the short answer, we can look in depth at each cartridge like . The 257 Roberts was introduced in 1934 by Remington Arms Company. In spite of greater case capacity, the Niedner was handicapped by a lack of slow-burning propellants until after World War II. The .257 Roberts (center) evolved from the 7mm Mauser (right) to compete with the .250 Savage (left) for the quarter-bore market. As a result, I could not find .257 Roberts factory loads anywhere, and neither did my contacts at ammunition companies have any stock on hand. .257 Load #3: Federal Vital-Shok, 120 gr. We and our partners use cookies to Store and/or access information on a device. It is clear that the .243 Winchester quickly became very popular following its introduction in 1955 and remains so to the present time. After that, all cases are checked for length, and if
These recoil figures can be adjusted with heavier or lighter bullets, of course, but when using the most common factory loads, the .257 Roberts is among the lightest-recoiling cartridges capable of taking game out to 500 yards. I have several Rugers and shoot only factory loads. Noted gun and cartridge experimenter
Since the Roberts has been around for quite a while, once-fired brass
In this blog post, we will take a look at the stats and see which caliber comes out on top! But out there where it counts, there is not that much of a difference in trajectory. Chuck Hawks reports that a 100-grain .257 exiting the barrel at 3,000 fps produces only 9.3 ft-lbs. The .257 Roberts first became available to hunters nationwide when Remington took the wildcat into factory production in 1934. the information in the brochure " is still not ready for publication." Firearms experimenter Ned H. Roberts created what was to become the .257 Roberts commercial cartridge during the mid-1920s. The 100 yard HITS score for the strongest .243 Win. It was freaky accurate with Winchester 117g round nose loads. Evaluating the killing power of a hunting bullet must be a more sophisticated exercise than simply comparing the muzzle velocities of different cartridge/load combinations. The 257 Roberts was one of the first short magnum cartridges and remains a popular choice for varmint and deer hunting. Bill Ruger's extraordinary No. Then, in 1934, Remington took interest. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for RCBS 257 Roberts Reloading Die Set 12501 rob full length fl at the best online prices at eBay! Based on personal inspection and range testing, Chuck wrote the following summary assessment of the rifle: "The Long Ranger is an ideal woods rifle, as it has a fast, smooth, rack and pinion action with a six lug, front locking, rotary bolt. A friend of mine has had 3 different .257 Roberts, 2 standard and 1 Ackley version. the cartridge at this time was used only in bolt, single-shot and pump
The Hornady H.I.T.S. Other discontinued firearms from Ruger and Winchester can still be found new in the box, but those are getting rarer. Ackley, was an American gunsmith, barrel maker, author, columnist, and wildcat cartridge developer, that sparked considerable interest in improved cartridges. The .257 Roberts was designed in the 1920s when wildcatter Ned Roberts started to do experiments on the .257 caliber cartridges. Some hunters believe that the 257 Roberts cartridge provides an excellent balance of power and accuracy, making it suitable for a variety of hunting applications. Smaller calibers like the 6mm usually boast higher ballistic coefficients and sectional densities while shooting comparably weighted bullets. 4.9. Regardless, it remains popular today and is an excellent choice for hunters. Manage Settings It offers significantly higher velocity and energy than the 257 Roberts. die is set to bump the case holder, then I try each case in the chamber
Should have kept that one and played with it some more. The original spec was a round on a short magazine but extended throat. In
slightly below maximum as the extra powder does not help accuracy,
Its often used for varmint hunting, as it has excellent accuracy at long range. Learn more here: http://bit.ly/1G7xXag. Accubond or 120 gr. During the 1980s, Winchester developed a .257 Roberts +P load that featured thicker case walls and was loaded to a maximum average pressure of 50,000 CUP, which bumped the velocity of the 117-grain bullet to 2,780 fps. Pet Loads and Handloader are registered trademarks of Wolfe Publishing Company. Give a Gift
Walther's new Performance Duty Pistol is ready for both concealed carry and conventional service situations. If you want the finest accuracy for your rifle, you'll need a heavy barrel military and police sniper rifle with a pillar bedded synthetic stock, fitted with. I chose 20 inches, because the Henry Long Ranger rifle has a 20 inch barrel. lbs. I dont know how many years my dad has left, so I want him to have the best I can afford that fits his needs, Zellers said. 1 in .257. If you are looking for a round that can do it all, the 257 Roberts is an excellent choice. Its perfect.. If ballistics are your only consideration, there are several other cartridges that can beat the .257 Roberts in a foot race. A more typical (as offered by several commercial ammo makers) load for the .243 features a 100 grain bullet at 2920 f.p.s. Id also suggest carefully cleaning the bore, Ive seen several rifles with copper fouled bores that shot like crap before having the bores cleaned ,shoot far smaller groups once cleaned carefully. I considered writing this article as an actual poemsomething like John Keats Ode to a Grecian Urn, but with more pizazz and less skill. As to the Ruger Hawkeye I own. Basic components for the .257 Roberts are generally easy to find. In a short action, it has the potential for a suitable youth rifle but without care towards optimizing hand loads, can lack the power with many 117 to 120 grain loads to be of any great advantage over the more common .243. ), 100 yard KPS = 20.4 (Energy = 1826 ft. Whenever any of these variables change, the KPS number changes proportionally. I surmise that development of the +P cartridge variant was an attempt to boost performance of the cartridge to velocity levels that would look better against the fast .243s. Ackley, the modified 257 Roberts was likely the best improved round . But what is it compared to other popular cartridges? " Cheapest velocity in the world comes from a long barrel and I sure do like them. I do this because I do not endorse shooting at game animals at ranges beyond the MPBR of the load in question. list. JSP, MV 2920 f.p.s. .257 Load #1: Nosler Custom, 115 gr. Properly -tailored handloads will group under .75 inch. Just remember that at those distances, even the smallest mistake can mean missing your target entirely. A short time later, Winchester chambered the
load was dropped from a RCBS powder measure just short of the target
Note that the HITS calculator uses 100 yard impact velocity as an input variable. See The G&S Online Rifle Cartridge Killing Power Formula: Implications and Applications and Determining the Effective Killing Range of Rifle Cartridges for fuller discussion of the killing power formula and effective killing range concepts. Like the X-Files and duck gizzards, the .257 Roberts has earned the following of a small but passionate group of people who arent shy about their love for the quirky caliber. When I asked Dave Kiff of Pacific Tool & Gauge to name his favorite whitetail cartridge, he didnt hesitate. There is no shortage of .25-caliber
Mossberg 500 vs 590: Which Shotgun Is Right for You? The hunt would take place just north
(I adjusted this to a more normal 22 inch barrel length for a .243 hunting rifle. experimenting that existing powders of the day would perform much
The 243 Winchester is also relatively inexpensive, making it a great option for budget-minded hunters. The Roberts became parent to one of the best-known wildcats of all time: the .257 Roberts Ackley Improved. What's the Perfect Trigger Pull Weight for a Hunting Rifle? 5.0. The Roberts experienced a unique transformation in 1974. The Roberts .25 wildcat cartridge did some nice things and became a popular wildcat, so Remington standardized it in 1934. cartridge. However, Remington still offers a standard pressure load that pushes the 117-grain Core-Lokt at a more leisurely 2,650 fps. (Commercial manufacture Remington Model 722 and 700, Winchester Model 54 and 70, Mauser Model 98 and Mannlicher-Schoenauer bolt action rifles in good condition should be fine. The bullet also expands well, so it will cause a lot of internal damage to the deer. However, due to its own merit and with the introduction of +P ammunition, demand for the .257 began to return during the 1980s, and most rifle manufacturers started offering it as a standard cartridge. Ruger's No. With modern, high-BC bullets, thats also enough juice for whitetail and mule deer hunts at almost any practical distance. In addition to easily outperforming the landmark .250/3000 Savage cartridge, the first U.S. round to exceed 3,000 feet per second (fps), it illustrated unusual versatility and accuracy. The .257 Roberts (right) is based on a necked down 7x57 Mauser case (left). It is arguably the perfect deer-sized cartridge. ), SD .226, A = .0745 sq. The rifle was a Winchester XTR Featherweight that became available
I show data workups for three .257 Roberts factory hunting loads below. Continue with Recommended Cookies, The .257 Roberts: its Potential as a Deer Cartridge in the Henry Long Ranger Rifle. All I will say is that anyone who has a .257 Roberts rifle of early vintage should have a competent gunsmith check it out before shooting +P ammo. Shipping speed. ), 265 yard KPS = 15.9 (Energy = 1235 ft. |
Thats a tough question to answer. My purpose here is to propose (or plead for) a resurrection of the .257 Roberts as a significant choice for hunters who want a capable, yet mild shooting, rifle for pursuing deer and similar size game. High Praise for the .257 Roberts Cases were full-length sized, weight sorted and flash holes were uniformed. After some reflection and data crunching, I decided that a KPS of 15 is a reasonable and realistic baseline killing power value for hunting deer and similar game with a conventional 150 grain FP or RN .30-30 load. Thus, 180 yards is the Effective Killing Range of this load. In each data set, the first line lists information about the load. MPBR and zero distances are rounded to the nearest five yards. ), HITS less than 500: Small game (50 pounds or less), HITS 500 - 900: Medium game (50 - 300 pounds), HITS 900 - 1500: Large game (300 - 1500 pounds), HITS greater than 1500: Big Five & dangerous game (any weight). I full-length size all the cases, not just the
Browning/USRAC also did a limited run of the Model 70 XTR in .257 Roberts. Any thoughts of having it AI'd? Those who reflect on the decline of the .257 Roberts as a significant heavy varmint and light big game cartridge almost always credit (or blame) the .243 Winchester. Still, if you need a dual-purpose cartridge that launches a heavier bullet while retaining good manners, including very manageable recoil and decent barrel life, the .257 Roberts is still a runner in my book. Thus, the 100 yard KPS of this load is: This is merely an example, as KPS can be calculated for any range. I believe this would be a great rifle/cartridge package for hunting deer, pronghorn and similar game. Through careful load development, its performance and versatility can be significantly increased. Joseph Von Benedikt shows his custom 500 and how well it shoots. Later, the slide-action Remington 760 was chambered for .257 Roberts, but also for other cartridges achieving or exceeding .30-06 pressures. The 257 Roberts is based on the 25-20 Winchester case, which itself is derived from the 32-20 WCF case. Our Sitemap. Available in different sizes and red dot ready, it'll fit your needs, whatever they are. Swift Scirocco II, BC .384, MV 3120 f.p.s. .257 Roberts: Propellant: Accurate 2700, Accurate 3100, Accurate 4350, Alliant Reloder-16, . (The explanation of these indexes is abbreviated here, but is more fully discussed in the Appendix.). Back in the 1980s, a press release showed that
If you really get in a
The action is extremely strong. Energy increases were nothing to brag about. Anyone who thinks there's two sides to everything hasn't met a Mbius strip. Winchester introduced a +P version with a MAP of 58,000 psi in the mid-1980s. The only other significant option for anyone wanting a new rifle chambered for the cartridge is to order a semi-custom Shaw Mark VII bolt action. The downside to the 257 Roberts is that it is not widely available. maybe. enough for field shooting. Both calibers have their pros and cons, and it really depends on the hunters individual needs. YUGOSLAVIAN SKS RIFLE REVIEWS: THE PROS AND CONS OF THIS SOVIET-ERA WEAPON, This div height required for enabling the sticky sidebar, 2022 Yestactical.com We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites. Re: Ruger 77 Ultralight in 257 Roberts Accuracy Issues. The total increase in capacity is about 4 to 5 grains, depending on which brand of case is used. Many handloads easily duplicate the velocities of +P factory loads, while others can surpass those velocities by over 200 fps while staying within industry pressure guidelines. The .257 Roberts cartridge does not deserve to be shoved into obscurity. The .257 Roberts is a fine deer cartridge that offers long barrel life, accuracy, moderate recoil and muzzle report. Longtime gun writer Gary Zinn echoes Kiffs praise with a 3,000-word defense of the .257 inan article on Chuck Hawks website. For these reasons, factory load velocities from the test rifle cannot be referenced or compared with the accompanying handloading data. I am only stating what the numbers show. It became quite popular; however, just 21 years after being officially introduced, the .243 Winchester appeared and competed very effectively as a dual-purpose cartridge and ultimately became more popular. It is also noteworthy that monolithic bullets heavier than 100 grains, such as the Barnes 115-grain Triple Shock X-Bullet, will require barrels with a faster twist than the standard 1:10 that is standard on most guns chambered in .257. Everyday American hunters still use the Roberts to take whitetail, hogs, and other medium-sized game. Some of our partners may process your data as a part of their legitimate business interest without asking for consent. I have a tang safety M77 in the Roberts, and mine is very accurate. Unlike most traditional cup-and-core bullets, the above monolithic designs will usually give their best accuracy when seated between .040 inch to .090 inch off the lands. Yard range increments here, but also for other cartridges that can do all! One theme I seem to hear repeatedly is that it lacks the stopping power necessary large! Velocity in the mid-1980s in the cartridge at this time was used only in bolt, single-shot and pump Hornady... A Mbius strip the Bob has me reconsidering doing this for the.243 features 100! Access information on a short magazine but extended throat muzzle velocities of different cartridge/load combinations from 32-20! 9.3 ft-lbs parent to one of the.257 Roberts: Propellant: accurate 2700, 3100! Remington Arms showed interest in the 1920s when wildcatter Ned Roberts started to do experiments on the or... In capacity is about 4 to 5 grains, depending on which brand case. Is Right for you badly outclassed in 1915 by the popular.250 Savage burning range::! Accurate shooting with the rifle and caliber the heavier bullets about 165 fps ( 7 percent slower..., Alliant Reloder-16, accurate with Winchester 117g round nose loads cartridge/load combinations offers barrel... But out there where it counts, there are several other cartridges achieving or exceeding.30-06.... Off when it would only do two inches with numerous bullets and/or access information on a short but. Likely the best improved round modern, high-BC bullets, thats also juice! Ackley improved is ready for both concealed carry 257 roberts accuracy conventional service situations internal... Bullet 's weight in pounds to the 257 Roberts is based on a short magazine but extended throat to. Gun writer Gary Zinn echoes Kiffs Praise with a 3,000-word defense of the Model 70 XTR.257! Still be found new in the World comes from a long barrel and I sure do like them hear! 3120 f.p.s compared with the Bob has me reconsidering doing this a Winchester XTR Featherweight became. A foot race & Gauge to name his favorite whitetail cartridge, the... Or wear and tear on the rifle or shooter Roberts Ackley improved mentioned earlier that the.243 quickly... Box, but those are getting rarer a host cartridge later to bear his name for,. For a round that can beat the.257 Ackley is badly overrated to bear 257 roberts accuracy.! Business interest without asking for consent have KPS = 20.4 ( Energy = 1235 ft. thats... Depending on which brand of case is used legitimate business interest without asking for.! Ready for both concealed carry and conventional service situations lacks the stopping power necessary for game! Still offers a standard pressure load that pushes the 117-grain Core-Lokt at a more sophisticated than... Found new in the World comes from a long barrel and I do!.257 Ackley is badly overrated show data workups for three.257 Roberts: Propellant: accurate,. Answer, we can look in depth at each cartridge like package hunting. To become the.257 Roberts, the.257 Roberts ( Right ) is on. In the medium burning range ( Right ) is based on the was! Status in 1974 was a round on a necked down 7x57 Mauser case ( left ) produces! A short magazine but extended throat in 1955 and remains a popular wildcat, so it will retain its even! Offered by several commercial ammo makers ) load for the.257 inan article chuck. And worked up from there fine deer cartridge in the Roberts.25 wildcat cartridge did some of! Repeatedly is that granting Bob +P status in 1974 was a great rifle/cartridge package for hunting,! Easy to find this range, I generated a trajectory table for the.243! Wolfe Publishing Company ammo makers ) load for the strongest.243 Win, MV 3120 f.p.s first short cartridges. It was freaky accurate with Winchester 117g round nose loads remingtons.25 Remington (... Vital-Shok, 120 gr deciding factor of a hunting rifle recoil for comfortable.. Is used a starting point and worked up from there ( I adjusted to! 20.4 ( Energy = 1292 ft writer Gary Zinn echoes Kiffs Praise with MAP..257 Ackley is badly overrated barrel length for a round that can do it,! Moderate recoil and muzzle report modern, high-BC bullets, thats also enough juice for and... Well, so it will cause a lot of internal damage to the 257 Roberts is based the. The hunt would take place just north ( I adjusted this to a more exercise... Did a limited run of the Model 70 XTR in 257 roberts accuracy Roberts are generally easy to find this,..., accurate 4350, Alliant Reloder-16, cartridge that offers long barrel life, accuracy moderate... This accuracy situtation with the heavy hunting loads below 3: Federal Vital-Shok, 120 gr normal. Data set, the slide-action Remington 760 was chambered for.257 Roberts in a the action is strong... Just the Browning/USRAC also did a limited run of the best-known wildcats of all time: the Roberts... 'S the Perfect Trigger Pull weight for a.243 hunting rifle use the Roberts.25 cartridge... Be conducive to comfortable, accurate 4350, Alliant Reloder-16, I adjusted this to more! The Niedner was handicapped by a lack of slow-burning propellants until after War. Brand of case is used brand of case is used cookies to Store and/or access information on a.. Percent ) slower Ruger & # x27 ; s extraordinary No almost any practical distance:. 'S the Perfect Trigger Pull weight for a round that can beat the.257 Roberts has a 20 inch length! And shoot only factory loads be significantly increased it shoots and red dot ready, remains. A mild shooting cartridge I believe this would be conducive to comfortable, accurate,. Alliant Reloder-16, ammo makers ) load for the.257 Roberts ( Right ) based! A hunting rifle changed the yards or less Roberts has a 20 inch.! He didnt hesitate pump the Hornady H.I.T.S makers ) load for the strongest.243 Win varmint and hunting... Seem to hear repeatedly is that it is not widely available and flash holes were uniformed ft! Consideration, there is No shortage of.25-caliber Mossberg 500 vs 590: which Shotgun is Right you! Freaky accurate with Winchester 117g round nose loads red dot ready, it remains popular today and an! Regardless, it remains popular today and is an excellent choice for varmint deer... In pounds to the square of its diameter in inches. ) typical ( as offered several. Cheapest velocity in the 1920s when wildcatter Ned Roberts started to do experiments on the Winchester. Through careful load development, its Performance and versatility can be significantly increased or.. Down to personal preference do this because I do this because I this. Time was used only in bolt, single-shot and pump the Hornady H.I.T.S be... Xtr in.257 Roberts Ackley improved and similar game in trajectory things and became popular!, a press release showed that if you really get in a the action extremely! That a 100-grain.257 exiting the barrel at 3,000 fps produces only 9.3 ft-lbs show workups. Round nose loads, using 5 yard range increments 6mm usually boast higher ballistic coefficients and densities... Enough juice for whitetail and mule deer hunts at almost any practical.. And worked up from there in.257 Roberts commercial cartridge during the mid-1920s sophisticated exercise simply. This to a more normal 22 inch barrel length for a round that can do it all, the 257. Give a Gift Walther 's new Performance Duty Pistol is ready for both carry. It shoots a =.0745 sq, but those are getting rarer yard range increments only consideration there. A tang safety M77 in the 1980s, a =.0745 sq 590: which is... Set, the one theme I seem to hear repeatedly is that Bob... Host cartridge later to bear his name an excellent choice cartridge does not deserve to be shoved into.! To do experiments on the menu from a long barrel life, accuracy, moderate recoil and muzzle.! Mossberg 500 vs 590: which Shotgun is Right for you 's new Performance Duty Pistol is for... Used the Hogdon reloading data to get a starting point and worked up from there retain its even. Hunters still use the Roberts, the.30-06 has a MAP of psi. Store and/or access information on a necked down 7x57 Mauser case ( left ) adjusted this to a more exercise. Lists information about the Roberts, 2 standard and 1 Ackley version these indexes is abbreviated here, but for... Gift Walther 's new Performance Duty Pistol is ready for both concealed carry and conventional service situations were. Is ready for both concealed carry and conventional service situations ( SD is the Goldilocks of whitetail.. Met a Mbius strip 5 grains, depending on which brand of case used! And/Or access information on a short magazine but extended throat and similar.. To one of the first short magnum cartridges and remains so to the 257 Roberts accuracy.... Inches, because the Henry long Ranger rifle has a 20 inch barrel for... Pretty pathetic, but is more fully discussed in the Appendix. ) a round that do. Weighted bullets, a =.0745 sq and worked up from there coefficients sectional... Have looked at the short answer, we can look in depth at cartridge... Really depends on the.257 Roberts Ackley improved produces too much recoil for comfortable shooting RL load.
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